AppliedVisual
Nov 15, 06:10 PM
This is not true at all. Multi-threading often introduces more problems such as race conditions, deadlocks, pipeline starvations, memory leaks, cache coherency problems. Further more, multithreaded apps are harder and take longer to debug. Also, using threads without good reason too is not efficient (context swtiching) and can cause problems (thread priorities) with other apps running. This is because threads can not yield to other threads and block if such an undesirable condition like a deadlock exists.. Like on Windows when one app has a non responsive thread and the whole system hangs.. Or like when Finder sucks and locks everything..
Yes, yes, all true... Somewhat. True in the sense of how a lot of programmers approach current threading problems and various development theories. And we're currently limited by our development tools and the operating systems to a certain degree.
Also, multithreading behaves differently on different platforms with different language environments. Java threading might behave differently than p-threads (C-based) on the same system (OS X).. I am a prfessional developer etc..
Yes, but so many things behave differently from one platform to another. How is writing a low-level thread management system for each platform different than writing the core functions of a 3D graphics engine that can run cross-platform and take advantage of various differences or feature - OpenGL, Direct3D, 3DNow, etc.. Cross-platform development always has its issues as do using different development tools. You obviously know this as do many programmers, so what's the point of the doom and gloom? It's always been this way and is just a part of the development process.
Massively multithreaded apps do exist and have been written for various platforms over the years. Here in Windows and OSX land programmers go into panic mode when multithreading is mentioned. Yet SGI had Irix scaled to 256 CPUs and visulization apps utilizing multithreading on individual systems as well as across cluster nodes and displaying images built by multiple graphics pipes using multithreaded OpenGL that could scale from 1 to 16 graphics pipes and any number of CPUs.
Anyway, my whole point is that the software industry will eventually have to tackle this problem head on and will overcome it. I just don't understand the current resistance and denial exhibited by so many "developers". The hardware is coming, in many situations it's already here... Why fight it? It's time to look at threads in a new light (for many). Upcoming CPU roadmaps place newer quad-core chips in the market in mid '07 with common Xeon and Opteron workstations/servers moving to quad-CPU (16-core) with 45nm process and lower wattage. 8-core CPUs to arrive in '08, 12 and 16 cores per CPU in late '08 or early '09...
MHz isn't increasing and the consumer still wants the next version of their game or video editor to run twice as fast with more features on the new stystem they just bought, which now has 32 cores instead of 18 cores and they'll switch to a competitor's product if you take more than two or three months to ship your software update... What do you do?
Yes, yes, all true... Somewhat. True in the sense of how a lot of programmers approach current threading problems and various development theories. And we're currently limited by our development tools and the operating systems to a certain degree.
Also, multithreading behaves differently on different platforms with different language environments. Java threading might behave differently than p-threads (C-based) on the same system (OS X).. I am a prfessional developer etc..
Yes, but so many things behave differently from one platform to another. How is writing a low-level thread management system for each platform different than writing the core functions of a 3D graphics engine that can run cross-platform and take advantage of various differences or feature - OpenGL, Direct3D, 3DNow, etc.. Cross-platform development always has its issues as do using different development tools. You obviously know this as do many programmers, so what's the point of the doom and gloom? It's always been this way and is just a part of the development process.
Massively multithreaded apps do exist and have been written for various platforms over the years. Here in Windows and OSX land programmers go into panic mode when multithreading is mentioned. Yet SGI had Irix scaled to 256 CPUs and visulization apps utilizing multithreading on individual systems as well as across cluster nodes and displaying images built by multiple graphics pipes using multithreaded OpenGL that could scale from 1 to 16 graphics pipes and any number of CPUs.
Anyway, my whole point is that the software industry will eventually have to tackle this problem head on and will overcome it. I just don't understand the current resistance and denial exhibited by so many "developers". The hardware is coming, in many situations it's already here... Why fight it? It's time to look at threads in a new light (for many). Upcoming CPU roadmaps place newer quad-core chips in the market in mid '07 with common Xeon and Opteron workstations/servers moving to quad-CPU (16-core) with 45nm process and lower wattage. 8-core CPUs to arrive in '08, 12 and 16 cores per CPU in late '08 or early '09...
MHz isn't increasing and the consumer still wants the next version of their game or video editor to run twice as fast with more features on the new stystem they just bought, which now has 32 cores instead of 18 cores and they'll switch to a competitor's product if you take more than two or three months to ship your software update... What do you do?
SciFrog
Dec 13, 06:09 PM
Thanks.
I was over at kakaostats and saw there is someone new this week "elena" (http://kakaostats.com/usum.php?u=1604130), up only since tuesday and they already have over 4M points! Must be an institution with a wicked fast cluster? Some serious players out there...
You are #103 cruncher for the whole project, whao!
And actually #1 and #2 are default user, not real...
Impressive.
Can't wait for Gulftown Mac Pros and SMP2 (maybe 60k PPD with one machine?).
I was over at kakaostats and saw there is someone new this week "elena" (http://kakaostats.com/usum.php?u=1604130), up only since tuesday and they already have over 4M points! Must be an institution with a wicked fast cluster? Some serious players out there...
You are #103 cruncher for the whole project, whao!
And actually #1 and #2 are default user, not real...
Impressive.
Can't wait for Gulftown Mac Pros and SMP2 (maybe 60k PPD with one machine?).
Photics
Mar 25, 06:08 PM
This is cool to look at, but it's just a workaround for what should be happening... the Apple TV should run apps / play games. It's an iOS device. There's no need to get crazy with wires hanging off the side of an iPad.
While I like seeing developers getting creative like this, I don't consider this mainstream gaming. An iPad 2 is $500. A PlayStation 3 is much cheaper.
While I like seeing developers getting creative like this, I don't consider this mainstream gaming. An iPad 2 is $500. A PlayStation 3 is much cheaper.
Fraaaa
Apr 2, 07:15 PM
You sure? The DP2 installer is 3.7GB vs. 3.35GB of DP1.
Leopard requires 9GB, Snow Leopard requires 5GB, and now Lion is under 4GB?
Leopard requires 9GB, Snow Leopard requires 5GB, and now Lion is under 4GB?
capran
Nov 15, 01:45 PM
It turns out the 2.66 Ghz 8 core chips are about the same price as 3.0 Ghz 4 core chips. So the price differential will be product positioning, not raw cost.
Rocketman
Correction: You mean 2.66 GHz 4 Core chips versus 3.0 GHz 2 Core chips.
Woodcrest is a dual-core chip, Clovertown is 4. The Mac Pro uses 2 Woodcrests for 4 cores, a Mac Pro with 2 Clovertowns has 8 cores.
Rocketman
Correction: You mean 2.66 GHz 4 Core chips versus 3.0 GHz 2 Core chips.
Woodcrest is a dual-core chip, Clovertown is 4. The Mac Pro uses 2 Woodcrests for 4 cores, a Mac Pro with 2 Clovertowns has 8 cores.
dwarnecke11
Sep 30, 10:12 AM
I finally ordered a case. I'm sick of waiting for Best Buy to stock some decent cases.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0042BBHMS/ref=oss_product
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0042BBHMS/ref=oss_product
63dot
Jan 5, 09:05 PM
The MB W201 (1982-1993) was a brilliant small sedan, and you can still find them on the road today. Like any other German car, if you maintain it properly, it will run forever.
German, English, and Italian cars right out of the dealership are the coolest, best performing, best designed machines out there. And yes, they all need proper care.
It just that there are cars like cockroaches (not too expensive like a Carrera or Lambo and in no way as sexy) but they don't die, even when they are abused. Toyota pickups, Honda Accords (stock, not riced), and Volvos of old don't win style points, but they have the longevity that is legendary.
One of the coolest cars out there are most Jaguars from the 1970s until now, but I can't think of a car that breaks down more often, or is never seen in public if more than ten years old. There is no excuse for that. It's much more acceptable when a ten year old Yugo is not out on the road (when they hit that age back in the past) because they were very inexpensive. But at the same time period, dumping $25K or more into an XJ only to spend thousands more on repair on a car you would have to eventually sell is not acceptable.
A lawyer friend of mine got divorced and had to get rid of a car. She lived in a small, rented house and had no use for two cars. She was down to a rather new Honda Accord or a nice metallic green Jaguar 12 cylinder. She kept the Jag and dumped the Accord, which she got for top dollar. A few years later, she dumped the Jag. Not only was there the typical Jag problems that plague the maker, but the sun (near the ocean) did a job on the metallic green paintjob as it does to all metallic green paint jobs.
German, English, and Italian cars right out of the dealership are the coolest, best performing, best designed machines out there. And yes, they all need proper care.
It just that there are cars like cockroaches (not too expensive like a Carrera or Lambo and in no way as sexy) but they don't die, even when they are abused. Toyota pickups, Honda Accords (stock, not riced), and Volvos of old don't win style points, but they have the longevity that is legendary.
One of the coolest cars out there are most Jaguars from the 1970s until now, but I can't think of a car that breaks down more often, or is never seen in public if more than ten years old. There is no excuse for that. It's much more acceptable when a ten year old Yugo is not out on the road (when they hit that age back in the past) because they were very inexpensive. But at the same time period, dumping $25K or more into an XJ only to spend thousands more on repair on a car you would have to eventually sell is not acceptable.
A lawyer friend of mine got divorced and had to get rid of a car. She lived in a small, rented house and had no use for two cars. She was down to a rather new Honda Accord or a nice metallic green Jaguar 12 cylinder. She kept the Jag and dumped the Accord, which she got for top dollar. A few years later, she dumped the Jag. Not only was there the typical Jag problems that plague the maker, but the sun (near the ocean) did a job on the metallic green paintjob as it does to all metallic green paint jobs.
jholzner
Nov 29, 03:13 PM
For the love of god Steve, you need to come out with a TiVo/Media Center PC KILLER. I would love to see that.
Yep, cause the media center PCs are selling hand over fist and Tivo is making more money than they know what do do with. Oh, wait...
Yep, cause the media center PCs are selling hand over fist and Tivo is making more money than they know what do do with. Oh, wait...
darkplanets
Jun 22, 12:13 PM
As long as it has OSX (or whatever the next is) underneath, always, then I have no problems with an integrated iOS layer in OSX. In fact, I would much rather see dashboard disappear and iOS take its place, because let's face it; dashboard is worthless due to its horrible implementation.
Let's make that a prediction, shall we?
If this comes to fruition I see dashboard getting the boot and the iOS overlay taking its place, but only on touch enabled macs.
Can someone say new touch enabled cinema display, as well as the new "track pad gadget" being released? This would make perfect sense, if this rumor were true.
Let's make that a prediction, shall we?
If this comes to fruition I see dashboard getting the boot and the iOS overlay taking its place, but only on touch enabled macs.
Can someone say new touch enabled cinema display, as well as the new "track pad gadget" being released? This would make perfect sense, if this rumor were true.
popelife
Jan 3, 08:07 PM
I guess a 14�� laptop with a decent word processor is too much to ask for?
What's wrong with a MacBook and:
a) Pages
or
b) MS Word (yuck... but ymmv)
or
c) Framemaker in Boot Camp
?
Agreed, the world of word processing isn't overrun with great apps. Times change, and word processing just isn't sexy any more... even though there are plenty of theses and books and magazine articles still being written.
(I notice that MS are preparing to give away updates to Office 2007 - and Vista - to anyone that got Office pre-installed on their PC. Talk about abusing their monopoly... No struggling WP developer can hope to survive against those sort of tactics.)
With a bit of luck Pages 3.0 will be along next week. Hardly a keynote showstopper, but props to Apple for getting into that market at all. Pages is cute.
If you specifically need the long-doc and publishing features of Framemaker, then it's Windows time. Sad but true. Take it up with Adobe.
What's wrong with a MacBook and:
a) Pages
or
b) MS Word (yuck... but ymmv)
or
c) Framemaker in Boot Camp
?
Agreed, the world of word processing isn't overrun with great apps. Times change, and word processing just isn't sexy any more... even though there are plenty of theses and books and magazine articles still being written.
(I notice that MS are preparing to give away updates to Office 2007 - and Vista - to anyone that got Office pre-installed on their PC. Talk about abusing their monopoly... No struggling WP developer can hope to survive against those sort of tactics.)
With a bit of luck Pages 3.0 will be along next week. Hardly a keynote showstopper, but props to Apple for getting into that market at all. Pages is cute.
If you specifically need the long-doc and publishing features of Framemaker, then it's Windows time. Sad but true. Take it up with Adobe.
popelife
Jan 2, 03:35 PM
Since Intel is releasing the 2.0 Ghz C2Q chip this week, it seems likely to find its way into an iTV and/or iMac device. That's four cores on the cheap.
Rocketman
I see where you're coming from, but I believe the processor in the current iMacs is the laptop Merom C2D, which is why the iMac tops out at 2.33GHz, and the FSB is 667MHz. TDP for most Meroms is 35W.
The Core 2 Quad is a desktop processor, with a TDP more like 80-100W. So not suitable for the iMac without a big redesign.
Do correct me if I'm wrong.
Wasn't aware there's a 2.0GHz version of C2Q...
Rocketman
I see where you're coming from, but I believe the processor in the current iMacs is the laptop Merom C2D, which is why the iMac tops out at 2.33GHz, and the FSB is 667MHz. TDP for most Meroms is 35W.
The Core 2 Quad is a desktop processor, with a TDP more like 80-100W. So not suitable for the iMac without a big redesign.
Do correct me if I'm wrong.
Wasn't aware there's a 2.0GHz version of C2Q...
ngenerator
Sep 14, 08:57 AM
This story gets buried in the blog and a story of ninja stars makes page one? No Apple bias here. :rolleyes:
I lol'ed, how is this not a larger story? Wth is going on today?!?
I lol'ed, how is this not a larger story? Wth is going on today?!?
Zaty
Mar 20, 09:52 AM
If you want to compare Macs to PCs, you just can't take any PC being sold for $500. Like other people said, you get what you pay for. On the other hand, not every PC is a piece of crap (hardware wise). I bought a top of the line PII 450MHz in late 1998. It cost almost $2000 back then. But guess what, it's still running happily. The question is how long is the computer going to last? The more you pay, the longer your computer (Mac or PC) normally lasts. The good thing about Apple is that there is no $500 crap.
res1233
Apr 12, 09:54 PM
Because pros don't need features to make their life easier, and help automatically organise footage?
Exactly. Apple's philosophy with all their software is to make it powerful, yet simple so that you don't have to be a pro to figure out how to use it, at least the basics. You can use Mac OS X without ever touching the terminal or using Applescript, but if you're an advanced user, you have a ton of features available to you, should you chose to take advantage of them. I think that's the direction FCP has gone with this version.
Exactly. Apple's philosophy with all their software is to make it powerful, yet simple so that you don't have to be a pro to figure out how to use it, at least the basics. You can use Mac OS X without ever touching the terminal or using Applescript, but if you're an advanced user, you have a ton of features available to you, should you chose to take advantage of them. I think that's the direction FCP has gone with this version.
AppliedVisual
Oct 23, 11:25 AM
Hey, if there's a rumor every single week that upgraded macbooks/mbps, it will eventually be true! :D :D :D
When it finally does come true, MR will announce it snidely: "Apple announces upgraded notebooks today, as predicted..." and link back to the one rumor (of dozens, I think) that was accurate.
Of course... That's the way a lot of this "inside" info works. There were several rumor sites claiming updated MBP systems at Photokina. For the sake of not flaming one only to flame another, the claims made by most of these sites mysteriously vanished by about day 2 of Photokina. They made a huge deal over it and then no retractions or anything, they just pulled the articles from their sites as if it had never existed. AppleInsider did this, but they must have actually got real insider info because they pulled their little tidbit about it the day before Apple's Photokina event (Aperture update). So someone must have tipped them off that no notebook update was happening.
When it finally does come true, MR will announce it snidely: "Apple announces upgraded notebooks today, as predicted..." and link back to the one rumor (of dozens, I think) that was accurate.
Of course... That's the way a lot of this "inside" info works. There were several rumor sites claiming updated MBP systems at Photokina. For the sake of not flaming one only to flame another, the claims made by most of these sites mysteriously vanished by about day 2 of Photokina. They made a huge deal over it and then no retractions or anything, they just pulled the articles from their sites as if it had never existed. AppleInsider did this, but they must have actually got real insider info because they pulled their little tidbit about it the day before Apple's Photokina event (Aperture update). So someone must have tipped them off that no notebook update was happening.
AppleScruff1
Apr 23, 06:53 PM
If it's all just speculation, why be so quick to shout "privacy invasion" when you don't know the full story? It can't be one rule for you and another for everyone else.
The technical explanation from an Apple engineer will probably be the best explanation we'll see - Apple's PR rarely go into technical details on such matters. Anntenna-gate has been the only exception to that rule I can think of.
I'm not the one being quick to shout privacy invasion, it was on every tv news channel and news site. Somebody thinks it's a big deal. Now Apple brass is in damage control mode and must come up with some type of answer to appease the public.
The technical explanation from an Apple engineer will probably be the best explanation we'll see - Apple's PR rarely go into technical details on such matters. Anntenna-gate has been the only exception to that rule I can think of.
I'm not the one being quick to shout privacy invasion, it was on every tv news channel and news site. Somebody thinks it's a big deal. Now Apple brass is in damage control mode and must come up with some type of answer to appease the public.
ppdix
Jan 31, 07:52 PM
:apple: user since 1987... Can't tell? :rolleyes:
wordoflife
Nov 23, 06:40 PM
Last thing I paid for was the fair to get on the public bus to get to school for $0.85.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bc/Bucharest_HESS_bus_1.jpg
That's not the city bus I took, I just Googled "public bus"
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bc/Bucharest_HESS_bus_1.jpg
That's not the city bus I took, I just Googled "public bus"
sord
Aug 6, 11:55 PM
Ok - I've been into Macs for a couple years now, so I don't have the history with the company of many of you do.
That said, it seems to me that with these ads or banners for Leopard, that it is closer to being released than we all might think. Has Apple promoted a product this way -- bashing M$ -- with out releasing the product soon after?
To me it just seems like real strong words to use if Leopard wont be out for a while, esp. if it will only be released around the time Vista will be next year.
Anyone know what I mean, or feel the same way?
Last WWDC Stevie said that Leopard would be announced at this WWDC - or at least demonstrated. My guess - late this year or early next it will be in stores.
Oh - and Powerbook G5s (dual core) tomorrow!!
That said, it seems to me that with these ads or banners for Leopard, that it is closer to being released than we all might think. Has Apple promoted a product this way -- bashing M$ -- with out releasing the product soon after?
To me it just seems like real strong words to use if Leopard wont be out for a while, esp. if it will only be released around the time Vista will be next year.
Anyone know what I mean, or feel the same way?
Last WWDC Stevie said that Leopard would be announced at this WWDC - or at least demonstrated. My guess - late this year or early next it will be in stores.
Oh - and Powerbook G5s (dual core) tomorrow!!
Unggoy Murderer
Apr 3, 02:54 AM
That's probably one of the most powerful adverts I've ever seen. Apple really are geniuses, no wonder competitors think "How the ***** do they do it?".
dubels
Jan 10, 08:12 PM
BTCC and V8 Supercars are the most exciting series left.
JFreak
Jul 20, 05:05 AM
Reading this thread I realized that technical issues are not deal-breaker for many people -- it's still price that matters the most. If download-to-own costs $10, then everyone keeps demanding better specs for the material and it never ends. But if rental costs a buck a piece, then it's fun to watch and quality feels acceptable.
It's all about money, guys. Like it or not.
It's all about money, guys. Like it or not.
easymac800g4
Jan 10, 11:39 PM
macworld said apple and dell are the only two computer companies that continue to turn a constant profit
iStudentUK
Mar 27, 05:22 AM
The AWACS involved are owned and operated by NATO. There may not even be US personnel on board.
Plus, Greece, USA and the RAF are also supplying aerial reconnaissance/warning craft of their own in addition to the 3 NATO ones.
I've been pleased by how cooperative the coalition has been. It hasn't been one country dominating. The French were first in, both the USA and UK fired missiles, the Canadians have been patrolling, and even countries with smaller armed forces add up to a significant proportion of the forces involved. There are rumours of UK and US special forces on the ground coordinating strikes as well.
Obviously the US makes up the biggest contribution, but France and the UK (together I think of these as the big three in this action) have still contributed plenty to the forces available.
Hopefully we will look back at this as how armed forces should be in the 21st century- sanctioned by the UN and in a real coalition.
Plus, Greece, USA and the RAF are also supplying aerial reconnaissance/warning craft of their own in addition to the 3 NATO ones.
I've been pleased by how cooperative the coalition has been. It hasn't been one country dominating. The French were first in, both the USA and UK fired missiles, the Canadians have been patrolling, and even countries with smaller armed forces add up to a significant proportion of the forces involved. There are rumours of UK and US special forces on the ground coordinating strikes as well.
Obviously the US makes up the biggest contribution, but France and the UK (together I think of these as the big three in this action) have still contributed plenty to the forces available.
Hopefully we will look back at this as how armed forces should be in the 21st century- sanctioned by the UN and in a real coalition.
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